I know this was already asked here but I didn't read an answer that really helped answer my thoughts on this. The biggest argument there is that Vader saw Luke with Obi-Wan and put 2 and 2 together. However.... During this time, it was fairly obvious Luke was nothing more than a padawan. Vader knows that he killed Obi-Wan but continues on in Return of the Jedi to say "I see Obi-Wan has taught you well..."

To me, this signifies that Darth Vader knew Obi-Wan was still able to communicate to Luke even after death. If that was the case... wouldn't he also be able to understand Yoda or other Jedi Council members would be able to do the same? Vader would naturally assume other Jedi to be killed due to Order 66, but he should also know that if Obi-wan can manifest through the force that so should Yoda. I am more surprised that the scene didn't go.. "Your training as a Jedi has been complete. You couldn't have done this alone... who taught you?" Bad dialog sure, but the principle remains.

So why does Vader say with fact that Obi-Wan taught him, and not with question or wonder about who finished his training/provided the training knowing that a few years earlier he killed Obi-Wan when Luke had minimal Force knowledge?

  • the new canon comics address this - Vader and Luke meet fairly soon after Yavin. Although, if you want to only consider the original films, Vader knew Kenobi was on the Death Star of course, and with a group of Rebels. Later, he senses the Force is strong w/ one of the Rebels that is now attacking the Death Star. He seems to have put two and two together by the time of Empire Strikes Back. Their conversation on Bespin confirms that Luke knew Kenobi: "he told me enough..."
    – NKCampbell
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 17:46
  • but knowing him and someone that is strong in the force doesn't equate to having your training complete. You can be very athletic, and I can hang around and talk to Michael Jordan all day, but that doesn't imply he taught me or completed my learning of basketball. He may have gave me tips, but if he died when I was still a noob, he didn't have much of a chance to refine or teach. It's just assumed.
    – ggiaquin16
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 17:49
  • As you've said, this is a duplicate. If you don't like the answers on the dupe, the preferred course of action is to 1) Answer it yourself 2) Post a bounty on the question 3) Prod the existing answerers with comments or 4) publicise the question elsewhere (such as on facebook or twitter).
    – Valorum
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 17:51
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    @Valorum I made the change cause that's really what I am trying to ask.
    – ggiaquin16
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 17:55
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    @ggiaquin If Jordan is the last living basketball player/coach in the universe, and I know you knew MJ, and now we're playing one on one and you're nailing fade-away jumpers or dunking over me with your tongue out, I'm going to put two and two together and assume MJ trained you prior to his death. It just so happened that Phil Jackson was, unbeknownst to me, still alive and actually trained you.
    – Chris G
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 19:42

2 Answers 2


    Ability to become Force Ghost after death was unknown to Sith. We know that from final episode of Clone Wars, Sacrifice. What Vader and Palpatine could have known is that Kenobi trained Luke, and of course that Kenobi was "destroyed" on first Death Star. They didn't know how long Obi-Wan trained Luke. Most likely they assumed Luke was trained from childhood (Jedi tradition) because Obi-Wan spent his final years on Tatooine, and Luke also lived there with his and Vader's adopted family. So, they most likely assumed that Luke did learn a lot from Kenobi, but could not use everything until his power has grown enough with experience and years.

  • 2
    new canon comics show Vader mocking dead Kenobi when he realizes Kenobi had years to train Luke and pretty much...didn't. Luke is raw and pretty much unskilled in the Force and combat when he comes up against Vader one to one in lightsaber duel in the Star Wars Marvel comic. Vader basically says "you totally failed Kenobi"
    – NKCampbell
    Commented Jun 6, 2017 at 21:50
  • @NKCampbell Good point, but it also somewhat contradicts "Obi-Wan has taught you well" line in the movie. It would not be a first time that new canon works screw up existing information.
    – rs.29
    Commented Jun 7, 2017 at 16:26
  • Thanks for the answer. The only thing I have is that... He knew Luke's ability when they first dueled in Empire Strikes Back. He knew his training was incomplete there. Since then, it was obvious he had his training completed. Was it assumed that Luke just "honed" his skills of what Kenobi taught him prior?
    – ggiaquin16
    Commented Jun 7, 2017 at 20:17
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    @ggiaquin - The ROTJ novelization shows the Emperor reading Luke's mind to find out Yoda had completed his training then mocking him about it. Commented Jun 13, 2017 at 15:17
  • @TheIronCheek Thanks! THAT is the answer I was looking for.
    – ggiaquin16
    Commented Jun 13, 2017 at 15:19

I seriously doubt that Vader knew that Obi-Wan could still communicate with Luke after the former died. First, during the 'trench run' on the first Death Star, Vader couldn't hear Obi-Wan's Force ghost speaking to Luke. Second, in Episode V, Vader tells Palpatine: "Obi-Wan can no longer help him (Luke)." I honestly think that Vader suspected that the 'living' Obi-Wan had trained Luke for longer than he actually had.

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