As it turns out, some part of the Seanchan appeared in The Great Hunt are minions to the Dark One. One would question if the Seanchan are really the heir of Artur Harkwing.

In fact, they are using creature such as grolms which could only be found in the portal world which Rand had been ( with Selene ). Whoever transport the grolms to the world could only be great Aes Sedai in the Age of Legends or one of the Forsakens.

  • There is speculation and hints that the Forsaken, especially Ishamael, had manipulated events to bring about the Corenne. I think at one point Ishamael suggests that he was responsible for sending Luthair Paendrag across the Aryath Ocean. However, this is more of the Forsaken manipulating unwitting victims.
    – Anthony
    Dec 7, 2012 at 0:10
  • Ishy is not only (supposedly) responsible for sending Luthair across the ocean, but he's also responsible for the butchered version of the Propecies of the Dragon that exists in Seandar, so he's been manipulating them for centuries to help defeat The Dragon.
    – KutuluMike
    Dec 7, 2012 at 3:04

1 Answer 1


Everything suggest the Seanchan are the genuine descendants of Luthair Paendrag Mondwin army that travelled across the Aryath Ocean. Whilst there are certainly high ranking darkfriends in their hierarchy, there is no evidence they are all minions to the Dark One.

Whilst it is true that creatures such as Grolm were brought from the Portal Stone worlds to ours by the natives of Seanchan (the continent), they were primarily used to fight the shadow and are not shadowspawn themselves.

In The Guide, there is more information about Seanchan (the continent) which covers the species (now) native there, such as Grolm.

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When Luthair Paendrag's armies began their conquest of Seanchan, they confronted not only the terrifying Aes Sedai who freely used the Power as a military weapon, but strange beasts out of nightmare that flew at them from above or attacked them with claws and teeth, often tearing men from their saddles to devour them on the spot.

It was these channellers which brought the creatures to Seanchan, not a Forsaken.

These strange new creatures were not Shadowspawn at all, but the descendants of beasts brought back from parallel worlds, via Portal Stones during the first thousend years after the Breaking, probably in an attempt to find aid against the real Shadowspawn

(From The Guide (The World of Robert Jordan's The Wheel of Time, Chapter 18 - The Exotic Animals of Seanchan))

The Grolm that Rand encounters in the Portal World suggests an alternative history in that world perhaps:

  • the Seanchan Corenne (the return) happened sooner
  • Luthair Paendrag Mondwin was never lost
  • The people of the main (from our point of view) continent used the Portal Stones more, like the natives of Seanchan did in our main timeline.

It's an alternative timeline so we'll not know for sure.

  • What is funny, is that Artur Hawkwing himself ( called by the Horn of Valere ) did not express any recognition of the seanchan, and he did help defeat his descendants, which is ironic. Dec 6, 2012 at 9:59
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    I would imagine that the Seanchan of present time bear very little relation to the army that Luthair took over the Aryath Ocean, Artur wouldn't recognize Grolm, Torm, Lopar (can't actually remember which were present on Toman Head / Falme) or sul'dam / Damane. Dec 6, 2012 at 10:10
  • And who made the sul'dam (s)? Dec 7, 2012 at 1:41
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    The sul'dam were made by one an Aes Sedai what went across the ocean with Luthair, to try and gain favor with one of the rulers of Seandar at the time; she was rewarded by immediately being leashed and becoming the first damane.
    – KutuluMike
    Dec 7, 2012 at 3:06

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