Timeline for As Part Veela, Why Could Fleur Delacour Use Polyjuice Potion to Transform into Harry, and Why Could Hagrid Not?
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26 events
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| Aug 9, 2017 at 3:55 | comment | added | Wildcard | @JanusBahsJacquet, am I the only one who reads this whole argument and just thinks...xkcd.com/915? | |
| Apr 13, 2017 at 12:43 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
replaced http://scifi.stackexchange.com/ with https://scifi.stackexchange.com/
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| Dec 18, 2016 at 0:42 | comment | added | Xavon_Wrentaile | Another possibility, giants and half-giants are shown to be resistant to certain magics. Polyjuice might fall into that category. | |
| Feb 7, 2016 at 18:50 | comment | added | Janus Bahs Jacquet | → only limitation was that non-humans couldn’t use Polyjuice as the ‘source’, then Lupin would have checked Hagrid, because he could still be an impostor (a human transformed into Hagrid). If the limitation were that non-humans could be neither source nor target, then Hagrid would be beyond suspicion, but Fleur wouldn’t have been able to transform either. The only possible scenario is thus that the limitation is on the target, which must be human. No other scenario fits the facts and Lupin’s statement. | |
| Feb 7, 2016 at 18:48 | comment | added | Janus Bahs Jacquet | @Slytherincess I realise this is an old post, but when you say, “As I read it, Lupin's comment to Hagrid implies that Hagrid cannot use Polyjuice because he's not 100% human -- he's half-giant, and therefore why would Lupin need to interrogate Hagrid, because of course a half-giant cannot use Polyjuice to begin with”, you are unequivocally reading canon wrong. There is no way the quote can logically mean that, unless Polyjuice does not work either way with not-100%-humans (and we know from Fleur’s transformation that this is not the case). If there were either no limitations or the → | |
| Oct 7, 2012 at 17:01 | vote | accept | Slytherincess | ||
| Jun 28, 2012 at 14:49 | comment | added | NominSim | @Slytherincess - Lupin sees Hagrid there in front of him, so he isn't talking about whether Hagrid himself could use Polyjuice at all, he is talking about whether someone else could use Polyjuice to turn into Hagrid. It doesn't make sense for Lupin to say "Oh I don't have to worry because you can't use Polyjuice", because Hagrid is standing right there, it was either someone else who had turned into Hagrid, or Hagrid himself. Lupin's comment indicates that the potion is for human use only, meaning it couldn't turn someone into Hagrid. | |
| Jun 28, 2012 at 14:19 | comment | added | DVK-on-Ahch-To | @Slytherincess - but that's the whole point NominSim and me are making - the contradiction does NOT exist because Lupin's comment to Hagrid does not mean what you think it means. It's inconceivable but most likely you are simply not reading it correctly (admittedly, based on very poor and sloppy wording by JKR). It's a problem with parsing JKR's English and not with canon consistency. | |
| Jun 28, 2012 at 14:04 | comment | added | Slytherincess | @NominSim - As I read it, Lupin's comment to Hagrid implies that Hagrid cannot use Polyjuice because he's not 100% human -- he's half-giant, and therefore why would Lupin need to interrogate Hagrid, because of course a half-giant cannot use Polyjuice to begin with. I do not believe I'm reading canon wrong; I understand what you all are saying. I do not expect people on this site to ever agree with my POV. Also, no one has mentioned Fleur and why she could take the potion. It absolutely is a contradiction and I expect it to be addressed to truly answer the original question. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 18:02 | history | rollback | DVK-on-Ahch-To |
Rollback to Revision 2
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| Jun 27, 2012 at 17:46 | comment | added | Rob | @NominSim that makes sense now. My brain was stuck in a loop. It has become clear now. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 17:07 | comment | added | NominSim | @Rob That interpretation of "human use" is not supported by canon. If "only humans should use it", then Lupin would have suspected Hagrid since it could have been a human that used the potion to turn into him. The interpretation that it can only turn the user into a human is supported by canon however. (Hermione with the cat, and Lupin not being suspicious of Hagrid) | |
| S Jun 27, 2012 at 16:58 | history | suggested | hammythepig | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
He only had numbers up to 3, added the 4th number to show his points clearly
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| Jun 27, 2012 at 16:56 | review | Suggested edits | |||
| S Jun 27, 2012 at 16:58 | |||||
| Jun 27, 2012 at 16:51 | comment | added | Rob | "Human use" makes it sound like only humans should use it, not that it should only be used to turn into a human. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 16:50 | comment | added | Rob | @NominSim or DVK has it wrong and it's just a mistake. It happens. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 13:27 | comment | added | NominSim | @Slytherincess DVK has it right here; The idea is that the potion is designed to transform into a human only, not that only 100% human's can use it. This is supported by canon, we see Hermione fail to turn into a cat, and we see that Lupin doesn't check Hagrid. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 12:02 | comment | added | Slytherincess | I know who Lupin is responding to. The quote I'm interested in is ‘The Polyjuice Potion is designed for human use only.’ I don't believe I'm reading that wrong. The rest of the quote I included was just for context. But to ask -- why were there no negative effects on Fleur? Because, as I mentioned in my original post, she's clearly not 100% human. Is there a canon reason for this, or is it just a discrepancy? | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 2:46 | comment | added | DVK-on-Ahch-To | Also, sorry but you're reading Lupin 100% wrong. See your quote: "Lupin To Harry: You might have been an impostor.’ - Hagrid: ‘So why aren’ you checkin’ me?’". Hagrid is upset that Lupin didn't verify that HE, Hagrid, was not an impostor - e.g. a DE who looked like Hagrid. THAT was what Lupin was responing to. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 2:44 | comment | added | DVK-on-Ahch-To | @Slytherincess - there were no negative effects on Fleur - she did turn into Harry. As far as Hagrid, I listed 3 reasons why there might plausibly be some issues, ranging from the PJ potion not working at all due to his magic resistance, to him looking like a (no pun intended) a giant version of Harry. But that's mostly speculation. | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 2:35 | comment | added | Slytherincess | I just don't interpret Lupin's statement that way. It is clear to me that Lupin is saying non-humans should not take Polyjuice Potion in this context. Are you saying there would be no negative effects on Fleur or Hagrid if they took Polyjuice? :) | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 2:31 | comment | added | Slytherincess | I remembered something -- I asked whether Polyjuice was a form of Transfiguration. I got one answer which concluded Polyjuice included Transfiguration. scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/14584/… Polyjuice can include the same issues of the displacement of mass as Transfiguration can. :) | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 2:29 | comment | added | DVK-on-Ahch-To | @Slytherincess - that's why I started out explaining why the whole premise is different - Lupin's concern (or rather lack of it) was about a HUMAN taking PJ potion to turn into Hagrid; NOT about Hagrid drinking PJ potion. Which is directly corroborated by Hermione's CS experience. E.g. the rule is NOT about non-humans taking the potion; but about humans using the potion to turn into non-humans | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 1:49 | comment | added | Slytherincess | I don't think there's any difference in "non-human" status between Fleur and Hagrid. Bottom line, according to JKR's own writing, Fleur should not have been able to use Polyjuice Potion at all; neither should Hagrid, as noted. It doesn't say "if you're a petite non-human, go ahead and use Polyjuice" or "If you're a massive non-human, don't dare to try Polyjuice." It says Polyjuice is intended for human use only. I just find this very puzzling. :) | |
| Jun 27, 2012 at 0:47 | history | edited | DVK-on-Ahch-To | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
added 903 characters in body; added 126 characters in body; edited body
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| Jun 27, 2012 at 0:41 | history | answered | DVK-on-Ahch-To | CC BY-SA 3.0 |