In Star Wars The Force Awakens,

We see Rey, a seemingly untrained Force sensitive, use a Jedi mind trick with seemingly no training.

I have a friend who claims it would be impossible for any untrained Force-sensitive to use an "advanced maneuver"

like the mind trick.

Have we ever seen an untrained Force-sensitive individual use such a Force Power prior to The Force Awakens?

Canon is preferable, but Legends will work in addition to a canon answer.

Note: Precognition or flying skills do not count as Force powers.

  • 18
    In Empire Strikes Back, Luke is able to use Force Pull without training from any other Jedi. But that was after a couple of years of knowing he was Force-sensitive, and even then he wasn't very good at it. Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 14:24
  • 23
    Are we not including Anakin's precognition as a child, Luke's impossible aim with his eyes closed after one week, tops playing with a Remote in a freighter, and Han's perpetually good luck?
    – user40790
    Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 16:23
  • 38
    If your friend's claim was true it would lead to a chicken-or-egg problem - how did the first/original "untrained" Force-Sensitives learn their skills? Clearly it's possible to develop these on your own, it's just that the progress and depth of skill may be lacking if compared to formal training. Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 18:06
  • 5
    I remember a comparison I read when the movie first came out: "Rey heard stories about the Jedi and their powers. So when she figured out she was force sensitive and that the Jedi were real she had some idea of the things she could do. Like we've never done magic before, but if we got our Hogwarts letter tomorrow, we would know it's leviOsa not levioSA"
    – Jake
    Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 19:16
  • 4
    Well, clearly your friend hasn't realized that Rey was a Youngling at Luke's academy and that she has received force training. ;)
    – Paul
    Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 23:33

12 Answers 12


Best example I can think of is in Star Wars Rebels, Season 1 Episode 1 (Droids in Distress), a barely trained (virtually untrained?) Ezra does a Force push on Agent Kallus to save Zeb at the very end of the episode.

The first thing Kanan said to Ezra following that incident:

Kanan: Your formal Jedi training starts tomorrow

This leads you to believe that Ezra has not had much, if any, Jedi training prior to this incident.

This is reinforced by some discussions earlier in the episode between Hera and Ezra in which he confides in her that he has not really received any training so far. I don't have the exact quote handy, but I believe Ezra's response to her question about how his training is going is "What Jedi training".

  • I'll accept this one for right now. With this one and Thomas's, there are at least two canon examples. I would love to know if there's any more.
    – Gremer
    Commented Jul 21, 2016 at 17:42
  • Being able to swing hard with a sword means that you are strong, not that you are a highly trained swordsman. Similarly, being able to instinctively push someone using the force doesn't mean you are capable of complex telekinetic manoeuvres such as peeling and cutting fruit in mid-air. While this is clearly proof of an untrained force-sensitive person being able to use the force, it does not convince me, in the spirit of the question, that this is an untrained person performing an "advanced" manoeuvre.
    – Dungarth
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 1:30
  • 8
    I, admittedly, don't even know what constitutes an "advanced" Force move. I would love to know if there's some objective standard by which Force moves are ranked, otherwise it just seems like speculation and conjecture on what does and doesn't constitute 'advanced'.
    – Gremer
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 1:56
  • @gremer you could do that as a second question but I fear that we have no information on that one though but worht a try I guess
    – Thomas
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 5:33
  • That question is up.
    – Gremer
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 16:10

In The Phantom Menace, Qui-Gon indicates the only reason young Human Anakin can compete with alien pod racers who have better senses or more than two grasping limbs, is because of his innate Force use.

QUI-GON : He can see things before they happen. That's why he appears to have such quick reflexes. It is a Jedi trait.

And who says Rey has no Force training. We don't know much about her past, but given the age she was left behind, the old Jedi Order would have already started her training. And she could have picked some things up from all of the time Kylo used his own Telepathy on her.

  • While this would normally be a good answer, I (read: my friend) believes precognition, which is what you're describing, is natural to all Force users prior to training.
    – Gremer
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 1:19
  • 1
    In fact, in the Legends canon, precognitive ability is one of the signs that Luke uses to look for potential apprentices before the opening of his Jedi Academy.
    – Dungarth
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 1:21
  • Weren't the knights of Ren hunting Jedi? Also, if I remember correctly, there were bounties on Jedi, as there were after order-66. She likely didn't use her powers in order to hide if she did have training so she wouldn't be hunted and killed/captured. (this all based on the current books, which are canon) Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 13:34
  • @Gremer - Objection! Facts not in evidence. In A New Hope, Obi-wan trains Luke to use Precognition (and possibly Jedi Reflexes) on the trip to Alderaan. There is no evidence of Luke using that power before (would have been handy when his Aunt and Uncle were about to be slaughtered). And as was mentioned in another answer, in Empire Strikes Back, Luke uses Telekinesis despite having no training. Commented Jul 23, 2016 at 1:44

In the legends X-Wing series of books Corran Horn (without training in the force) uses non-vocal force persuasion to discourage a stormtrooper from finding him while he is hiding.



In The Clone Wars episode Children of the Force, there are newborns and small children that were already being found by the Jedi but not yet taken. They could already levitate their toys.

Mind trick was not used there, but still though if one looks at Luke Skywalker even levitating things doesn't seem to be too easy (and I wouldn't count mind trick as advanced... stopping blaster shots mid-air or deflecting them with the hand I would count as advanced).


Entire population of planet Haruun Kal's population was described as force sensitive in Republic comics. They are considered as "Legends" now I guess.

An example would be Kar Vastor. Indigenous to Haruun Kal, learned about ways of the force by himself in a jungle, at least according to Legends. He even managed to beat Mace Windu into unconsciousness once.


If every Force-sensitive user needs a Force-sensitive master...

...who taught the first ever Force-sensitive master how to use the Force?

Logically speaking, at least one Force-sensitive individual has to have had the ability to use the Force without training or else no one would have been able to use the Force in the first place.

The Force is intuitive first; technical later. Think back to Luke's initial training with Obi-Wan and the Marksman-H combat remote droid. Kenobi didn't physically lead Luke through the "motions" of using the Force in order to blindly deflect the blaster bullets. He didn't hold Luke's hands and say, "Swing like this". He provided simple verbal commands to guide Luke into connecting with his abilities- it was up to Luke to discover what the Force actually felt like when tapped into and thus how to manipulate it. As far as I'm concerned, Luke is an untrained Force user who does end up deflecting shots from the remote droid through use of the Force- just with a little encouragement from Obi-Wan.

Rey had more "training" in the art of the Force Mind Trick than Luke did when it came to Force Precognition. Rey at least had the misfortune (but advantage) of seeing and experiencing Kylo Ren's Mind Probe which she intuitively was able to block by tapping into that specific area of the Force. From there, she need only apply her newfound power at getting into the mind of someone else.

On the other hand, Luke was told to strap on a helmet, become blind, pick up a very complicated weapon, and then deflect small blaster bullets with the "edge" of said complicated weapon- all without having the luxury of watching someone else do it or feel the ripple in the Force as another person performs the feat.

But then again, that's part of what makes Luke truly such a naturally powerful Force user.


Before Luke met Yoda, he could do some basic telekinesis with no real force training.

  • 4
    Can you expand on this? Seems a bit short and reads more like a comment at this point.
    – Möoz
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 1:34
  • 1
    @Mooz - well, I'd say it's an answer, but it clearly needs some kind of reference to either a scene in one of the movies in which he does it (I don't recall any, and I last watched them, oh, 3 weeks ago...) or some other media where it happens.
    – Jules
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 6:39
  • 1
    Doh! Of course there's a scene where it happens. Empire Strikes Back, where he retrieves his dropped lightsaber while hanging upside down! Stupid memory. :)
    – Jules
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 12:52
  • 1
    Lightsaber scene
    – zzzzBov
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 14:41
  • I'm not sure about "no real force training" - canonically, how much time was spent aboard the Falcon training with Kenobi?
    – recognizer
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 15:29

Another Legends Example:

In The Force Unleashed (Video Game) Star Killer can already grab a lightsaber using telekinesis as a toddler. Although it is not impossible he may have received training shortly after birth, it is very improbable.

  • I think you mean 'The Force Unleashed'. ;)
    – Gremer
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 12:53
  • Of course. In my defense it is really hot today ^^
    – Falco
    Commented Jul 22, 2016 at 13:03

Young Asajj Ventress instinctively Force-pushes a Weequay raider away from herself in Clone Wars, "Nightsisters" (Episode 12).

  • Can you offer a clip or at least a picture of her doing it?
    – Valorum
    Commented Jan 31, 2018 at 18:49
  • I thought of adding this one to my answer yesterday when i was rewatching The Clone Wars. Commented Jan 31, 2018 at 19:38

Kajin Savaros uses Force Push to actually disintegrate an Inquisitor on Coruscant.


If I recall correctly, Han Solo's intuition, "I've got a bad feeling about this", was attributed to his being a force sensitive. So completely untrained, he didn't even really believe in it at the time. I believe the source for that was either the formerly cannon novels or one of the RPGs.


Oh yes. When Jedi are first learning about their powers, they often can't control them. You know, the usual odd things. Letters flooding the house, inflating your aunt into a balloon--err...wrong universe.

Anyhow, I'd say it's safe to assume untrained force users have used their powers before. Before training existed, how did the early Jedi learn their skills? At the very least they first few Jedi would have to have been self taught.

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